S2 Ep4 - Decoding Canberra through Sidereal and Tropical Vedic Astrology with Kody Henry

Decoding Canberra through Sidereal & Tropical Vedic Astrology

[00:00:00] Introduction and Welcome

[00:00:00] Fiona Marques: Hello everyone. Welcome to The Vedic Astrology Podcast. My name is Fiona Marques and I am so happy to be here today with another episode and we are exploring the Vedic Astrology of "Place". What can you see; what insights can you have about a "Place" on the planet? 

And to join me in this episode, I have Kody Henry. Kody, would you say hello to all of our listeners please?

[00:00:34] Kody Henry: Hello everyone. I'm glad to be here.

[00:00:37] Fiona Marques: And Kody is here because although we live on different sides of the planet, we share the same hometown and we are going to look at the Astrology of our hometown, Canberra, Australia, the National Capital of the Country of Australia. So this is where we both lived and well, Kody lives there. I've lived there.

It's where I was born. Were you born in Canberra, Kody?

[00:01:02] Kody Henry: Yes.

[00:01:03] Fiona Marques: There you go. So it's where we born and where we've lived. And here we are, two Vedic Astrologers on the opposite sides of the planet, sharing this very special hometown. But not just that, it turns out we also share our work as Massage Therapists as well.

So maybe Kody, tell us a little bit about what you do in your work and what you do with Astrology.

[00:01:34] Kody Henry: I've always been interested in Astrology since I started meditating about 11, 12 years ago. I learned Transcendental Meditation and later on I realized that Vedic Astrology was the way to go.

And I've been practicing Vedic Astrology in a a clinic here, a professional way for about half a year now. But I've been doing private consultations for a little while, longer than that. 

[00:01:59] Fiona Marques: And so we have in common an interest in Vedic Astrology. We have in common being Massage Therapists, but I didn't know that you practiced TM because I also practiced TM, so we're like carbon copies of each other. 

Yeah. And I've meditated all my life, so I've, I love, it's my, yeah, go-to place. Got me through my childhood. And TM I learned as an adult, so I guess I was probably 30 or in my late twenties, something like that. And gosh, it just really accelerated the support for change in my life.

I was really impressed by how effective. TM is having done lots of different styles of meditation, throughout my youth. So big TM fan. 

[00:02:42] Kody Henry: Oh, that's cool. Another thing in common.

[00:02:44] Fiona Marques: I know, totally. Okay, so here we are, carbon copies of each other from the very same hometown, and thanks to you, we found each other here on the internet.

[00:02:54] About Canberra

[00:02:54] Fiona Marques: I want to start by sharing with our listeners a little something about Canberra, because although you and I are obsessed about it, other people might not actually know what Canberra is. I can start off by saying Canberra is the Capital City of Australia, but what else could we share with people about Canberra?

[00:03:15] Kody Henry: The the original name I was telling you before we started the recording was an Indigenous name I can't pronounce it correctly, but Ngambri,

[00:03:25] Fiona Marques: Okay. 

[00:03:25] Kody Henry: and then they couldn't pronounce the "NG" at the start, so they would call it Berry. And and we were, and we're going to talk about the the day that they actually named Canberra, and there was many different names, but the one they picked was an Indigenous name, which is pretty cool. 

[00:03:41] Fiona Marques: Yeah, exactly. And Australia has a lot of place names based on Indigenous words, doesn't it?

[00:03:50] Kody Henry: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely.

[00:03:51] Fiona Marques: Yeah. Although not. Not the other major Capitals. Like we have Sydney and Perth and Melbourne, and Hobart, Adelaide, Brisbane. These often had names of significant political figures during the colonial time of Australia. But apart from that, there are lots of place names in Australia that have unusual, for Anglo-Saxon ears', they have unusual sounding names. So that's how Canberra got its name. 

And we need to remember that Australia was six independent Colonies operating as their own little, almost kingdoms. They had domain over their land and the resources that were there and their people. So they were fully functioning Colonies that decided to Federate and come together and make the nation of Australia. And that only officially happened in 1901, right?

[00:04:48] Kody Henry: Yeah that's right. They were sitting the Parliament in Melbourne Victoria. And they said that they were, they had, the Capital had to be within a 200 and something miles of Sydney. And it had to, it was going to be Crown land and it was only going to be a certain size.

So what we've pretty much got Canberra is relatively small. It's three hours drive from Sydney. It is the Capital, not Sydney, for other people outside of Australia. It's and it's all owned, it's all Crown land, so that means that the the government owns all the land here. So we're actually renting from the government. If you have a house here or you own property, you don't actually own it fully and the government can can do what they want with it, if really, but but yeah, so we live in a pretty sort of unique place. We don't have many big buildings here. It's relatively modest, I would say.

What do you think about Canberra, Fiona? 

[00:05:45] Fiona Marques: Yeah, I think you could say that it's a unique, it's a bit strange and unusual because of what Kody's saying, that you can imagine these six Colonies all thinking they're very important, which they were and they are. And when they came together as a nation, if the Capital city had been put in one colony or another, it would've seemed to endorse that was the most important colony.

And so there was this idea of picking some neutral place to create a whole new city that would become the Capital of Australia. And they, as Kody was saying, there were a few limitations that it had to be within a certain range of distance, but then they went around looking and looking for places, and they picked Canberra, which was really basically not in any way developed. I think there, there might have been a couple of sheep stations or something, some farming land, but there was, in terms of buildings and administration and roads and all that kind of stuff, it was completely undeveloped. So it's a little bit like putting a pin in a map and saying that's where we're going to live.

And that's what makes it so fascinating for us to examine in Astrology is that we know exactly the time when this place was manifest, when it was created because it wasn't something that naturally developed little by little and became a village and then it became a town and 20 years later it became a city. And then 50 years later they decided to make it the Capital. It wasn't anything like that. It was really relatively bare land that on a particular day became the site of the Nation's Capital. 

So from an Astrology timing point of view, it's fascinating. And as Kody was saying, it's, it is, it's a very special city because it's nestled in the bush, so it's really integrated with the landscape as much as any city can be. And not a lot of skyscrapers. And the complete freedom to orientate and place the city as you would like. 

In fact, they ended up holding an international competition to design the layout of the city. And that's, those are the roads and landmarks that we drive along today are still from that original winning entry. So it's a very unusual place.

I guess other things that make it unusual are that sense of creation happening all at a similar time. So it feels like a, it can feel like a planned city or in some ways, like a fake city. It's people sat in a drawing room somewhere and said, oh, let's put some houses there and let's put a shopping center there and let's put a school over here. And so certainly when I was growing up and I lived there, sometimes Canberra suffered from that sense of having a good idea or good layout but not having enough people yet to really make it work. It's you want to design the city that people are going to grow into, so one of the weird things about Canberra is that it's planned and it can feel a bit fake or constructed sometimes. 

And then another weird thing about Canberra is that as it was created for the administration of this new Federation of Australia, it is the political Capital of the country and therefore it's filled with politicians and public servants and Canberra, the place, the word that we, that represents our hometown, Canberra is used as a synonym for the politics and the politicians and the decisions that are made in the Parliament House that's there. Sometimes it's very strange as a Canberran because you are, you get blamed for a whole lot of decisions that the public agree or don't agree with.

So I think that's another weird aspect of living there, that you are, it's a bit like what you were saying about the Crown land and renting is that as a resident of Canberra sometimes you feel that your place doesn't belong to you and you are being lumped in with the work that is done there. Can you relate to any of that, Kody?

[00:10:08] Kody Henry: Yeah, it's absolutely all of that. It's actually really interesting what you're just saying. . And it does feel like that because, Canberra also means meeting place. So I often feel that a lot of people come here for work and they're not necessarily going to stay here forever. 

It's been changing recently. I do think a lot of people coming here, staying here, growing up here. But it feels very transient, it doesn't feel like there's the biggest community here. Of course it always depends and it's just things that are interesting to, to look at. And it, it has something to do with the fact that it's a political state and and this is where all the big decisions are made supposedly. So yeah.

[00:10:49] Fiona Marques: Yeah. Yeah. And another, before we get into the Astrology, another factor for Canberra, and I don't know whether this has changed in the time that I've left, so I'm very hopeful that Kody is going to tell me, "Oh that's all moved on now". But I would say that in general, when I was growing up, there was a sense of shame if you are from Canberra, in that it's not a real place and it's...

[00:11:13] Kody Henry: Yeah.

[00:11:14] Fiona Marques: ... it's not something to be proud of, which I never really understood because it's such a beautiful city and it is planned and it's got not, of not just the Parliament House, but it's got the National Library and the High Court and the National Museum. And every institution that you can imagine is dotted around this beautiful lake that was created.

And for people that live there, it's a very easy city to get around the roads and the cycle paths are all thought out to link places together. So as a child, of course, I felt proud and happy about the place that I live, but as you grew up and you spoke to people from other parts of Australia, you would get derogatory comments about the place that you live.

And even now, here I am living on the other side of the world and everybody here thinks it's really cool to come from Australia. So Portuguese people think Australia is wonderful and me I can see how Portugal and Australia have a real connection in terms of the sunshine and the beach and just loving the good things in life. And so it's it's super cool. I'm from Australia, I'm super cool. But when I meet other Australians and then they say, "Oh yeah, where are you from in Australia?" and I say, "Canberra", it's like the cool factor just disappeared entirely. Now Kody, please tell me, has that changed in the time that I've been away? Is Canberra now cool? Or at least is it cooler?

[00:12:36] Kody Henry: It's definitely cooler. Yeah. Yeah. It's definitely not cool to be from Canberra.

[00:12:42] Fiona Marques: Okay.

[00:12:43] Kody Henry: But I think it's changing. So there's some hope for us.

Yeah. The problem is we don't have any beaches. So we're in land and it's really dry and most people come here on school trips if they're from Australia to go to the War Memorial or the Parliament House. And it's all a bit dull and a bit boring. There's no theme parks, there's no adventure sports, there's not much nightlife. Not many bands come here. There's not that much really going on compared to Sydney and Melbourne. 

But if you live here, it's awesome. There's so much nature. We are one of the cleanest air of any city in the world. You could look it up. We've got, I think we recently had the cleanest air. And the pay is one of the highest in Australia, if not the highest. The cleanliness is good. The unemployment is incredibly low. We've got so many things going for us.

Most people have a high quality of living, like the majority, like the 95%. It's the crime rate is incredibly low. I could go on and on, like

[00:13:52] Fiona Marques: Exactly.

[00:13:53] Kody Henry: amazing. So yeah, definitely like much to look at as a tourist, but if you live here, it's like amazing.

It's so 

[00:14:01] Fiona Marques: Yep. On the downside, however, it does get really cold. Kody and I are recording this at the, I'm in summer, Kody's in winter, and I would say it's challenging and cold. But I, what I also would say is we do have a beach, right? We do have. 

[00:14:17] Kody Henry: Sort 

of. 

[00:14:18] Fiona Marques: Jervis Bay am I.

[00:14:19] Kody Henry: Oh, Jervis Bay. Oh yeah. That's part of Canberra.

[00:14:22] Fiona Marques: Yeah, because that was part of the criteria that although they chose an inland venue, there must be a access to a naval port, if required. So for all of those Canberrans who live in Jervis Bay, we have not forgotten about you really are the cool ones. Alright Kody and I could wax lyrical about our hometown for the whole Podcast.

[00:14:43] Sidereal and Tropical

[00:14:43] Fiona Marques: However, we're also going to talk about some Astrology and we are going to really stretch your minds on this Podcast because da-da-da-lah ... we are going to talk about both the Sidereal view of Canberra and the Tropical view of Canberra. So we're going to look at both charts and I want you to relax about that concept and imagine that it's like examining an x-ray and an ultrasound of the same person.

So the data looks a bit different. The x-ray looks different from the ultrasound, but the person that is being examined remains exactly the same. It's just these filters that we use, the x-ray or the ultrasound help us to highlight and jump out particular features of that person that enable us to speak about them and have insights.

We are really going to stretch your brain cause we are talking about these two different charts. And to keep it simple, for those of us who are listening, only, we're going to speak first about the Sidereal view of Canberra, and then we're going to speak about the Tropical. So we'll try and in order for those people who are listening, try and keep them a little bit separate, at least at the beginning so that you can sort of bed in your mind where those planets are for Sidereal. We'll talk all about that. And then we will have a look at where those planets move to if we look at the filter of Tropical. 

So then Kody, let us dive in and turn our attention now to the Sidereal chart for the naming of Canberra. This is the main chart that we're going to refer to, to have some insights into the place named Canberra.

And Kody, can you tell us a little bit about this date, the naming of Canberra. What is the date and time if people want to bring it up on their own system?

[00:16:46] Kody Henry: It's March 12th, 1913, and we've got the accurate time of 12 noon midday. We've even got the place, Capital Hill.

[00:16:57] Fiona Marques: And we got photos of of it actually happening. I'll see if I can send you a link of the photo because this is a moment, it's one of those kind of ceremonial moments where drum roll and I think some earth was dug up or something. A little, shovel goes into the soil and we name this place Canberra.

[00:17:15] Sidereal Layout of the Canberra Chart

[00:17:15] Fiona Marques: And when we look at Sidereal, for everybody listening, we've got a Taurus ascendant, at 11º51' with Saturn there in Taurus around 6º. Then we have a big place of sky with no planets because we have nothing in the sky until Ketu in Virgo, the 5th house, and then again a space with sky because there's nothing until Jupiter in Sagittarius. Jupiter is in the 8th house. Mars in Capricorn, Sun in Aquarius, Rahu and Mercury together in Pisces and Venus and Moon in Aries.

[00:18:00] Kody Henry: The ascendent, we've got Taurus. So we've also got Saturn sitting there in the Ascendant which is a friend, great friend of Saturn and Venus friends. So that's that already shows that obviously Saturn and the traits of Saturn are pretty important in the naming of Canberra.

The way that I understood this is Saturn is like the sort of like the servant class or, and also like the, in the natural inhabitants, the Aboriginal people that have been there forever. And it's shows that, okay, the naming of Canberra, the Indigenous people have something to say, the Saturn, the old people.

And so that's the way that I looked at that. 

We've 

[00:18:42] Fiona Marques: beautiful. 

[00:18:43] Kody Henry: Yeah. And we've got the Sun in Satur n's sign, which is Aquarius. It's noon, so it's there, and right at the top of the sky shining down. Also highlighting that Saturn is important. And we've got Mars in in the ninth house in Capricorn.

So again, we've got a pretty strong Saturn energy here. We've got exalted Mars. So Saturn seems to be, have quite a little bit of strength here or a little bit of significance. The interesting thing I found is that Mercury, it's actually debilitated in Pisces. So that was kind of interesting to me because I thought, wouldn't Mercury be important? It's the naming of Canberra. But I guess not necessarily. Saturn is old things, long-term things. So you need to consider that this is going to be a long-term name. Saturn has to be pretty important. 

I see Moon in the 12th house in Aries. Venus is also there in Aries. Moon is in a friend's sign. Yeah. So it's interesting to look at. It was a pretty significant day, but there was a lot coming up to the day. They had a lot of other names, like really random names of the Prime Minister, names of just, people could send in their names, like the people, the servant class the average Joe's.

Even the aboriginals could choose a name. Like it was very much a democratic decision. Which is cool. Like that's, I think that's why, I think that's why Saturn, was in the ascendant on that day. And and they picked an Aboriginal name after all.

[00:20:18] Fiona Marques: I love what you're saying about Saturn on the ascendant and what you're bringing in about the common people having a real say in this naming day.

I also think that this says a little bit, doesn't it, about that shame or discomfort about being Canberran. There's something Saturn about not being flashy and not being comfortable with the limelight. And I also think this Taurus ascendant, like an Earth sign does say something about "The Bush Capital" and about how the design that ends up winning the layout of Canberra is really integrated with the landscape. That's what the architects were all about. And he also put a "House of the People", didn't he, on that Capital Hill or on the main hill in Canberra. Walter Burley Griffin had designed this "House of the People". So now it actually has Parliament House on it. So it's become the "House of the Politicians", but the original intention.

So I think you're right that Saturn energy is coming through in this view.

[00:21:17] Kody Henry: That's so interesting. That's awesome.

[00:21:19] Fiona Marques: I noticed as I'm looking at, this is the first time I'm seeing it Sidereal, but I noticed that the Ketu-Rahu access is on the 5th-11th house, which it also is when we go over into Tropical. And I thought that was a very good description of Canberra as well, because Ketu on the 5th, the 5 th house is our it's our kingdom, it's our leadership; being that that house where we create what it is that we're going to leave as a legacy where we really take control of our life path, we implement changes and mold our life in the way that we would like it to run and therefore leave the legacy. 

But having Ketu there for me shows that there's an expertise in this leadership area. This is something that the energy has developed on this 5th house. Meaning that Rahu is then asking for this place of Canberra to not be the leader that stands out the front and looks out and down over everybody and calls out the vision and the guidance. That's where... we've already done that.

Rahu is asking us to explore being one of the many, being part of the commune, creating community and leading from within a community of peers. And I think that's, it's a beautiful placement. It's in both charts. The 5-11 access. It's a beautiful placement for Canberra because I think Canberra really does struggle with that disconnect between having an enormous amount of administrative power centralized in Canberra. But how is that connected to the community? How do we translate the administrative decisions into improving people's lives and being one of the people rather than being authoritarian or, being on top of the people. So I think the 5-11 does speak to some of the challenges that Canberra faces in its relationship with Australia is how does it lead and how does it connect with the with the community, with its peers.

Can you relate to that, Kody?

[00:23:40] Kody Henry: Yeah. I love that. That's that's a really good way of looking at it. And I guess Ketu in the 5th in its own kingdom, that's what the, the, is it the monarchy? The.

[00:23:50] Fiona Marques: Yes.

[00:23:51] Kody Henry: England. England and their kingship. Yes, they have got mastery of that sort of domination that, that kingship, where Ketu is sitting. But with this axis, it's yeah, we want to create a democracy. We want to create fairness, equality and all those kinds of things. And that, that's how I always saw Canberra to be as a very Saturn and Venus a dominant place with Saturn being, serving the all. We're all here working together to the public service and the tax and all those kind of things. All very Saturn based things. But we've got this element of this element of Venus really strong here just of connection, with each other working together. And there's not that much sort of monarchy domination energy here. Yes, we're the Capital, but we're a pretty modest Capital. Could be because of this Saturn placement. I'd be Interested to see what in the in the Tropical.

[00:24:47] Fiona Marques: Do you want to go over and have a look at Tropical

[00:24:50] Kody Henry: Yeah. Should we? Yeah.

[00:24:52] Tropical Layout of the Canberra Chart

[00:24:52] Fiona Marques: Okay If our listeners let go of their map that you have in mind there, move that off to the side. And let's look at the stars if we put them through a Tropical filter. 

And in that case, we end up then with a Gemini ascendant 4º29'. No planets in Gemini, Cancer, Leo or Virgo. However, we do have Ketu in Libra, the 5th house. There are no planets in Scorpio, no planets in Sagittarius. Before we get Jupiter debilitated in Capricorn, the 8th house, Mars is in the middle of the 9th house, Aquarius. Sun is in the 10th house, as we were saying. This is a noon chart. It's in Pisces. Then we have Rahu and Mercury together in the 11th house in Aries. Before the 12th house we've got three planets, Venus, Moon and Saturn, all in the 12th house of Taurus. 

So some slightly different placements there from Sidereal. However, as we mentioned, some things stay the same. For example, Ketu-Rahu remain on the 5-11 axis, and Rahu is conjunct with, or in the same house with Mercury. So that's common to both charts.

In Tropical Venus and Moon are together in the 12th house. Which is also the case in Sidereal, Venus and Moon are together in the 12th house. However, in Tropical, Saturn is also in that 12th house. And did, just as you look at it, Kody, is there anything that you wanted to say straight away about those differences?

[00:26:44] Kody Henry: I'm looking at the 12th house placement with Saturn, Moon and Venus. That's getting my attention. 

[00:26:51] Fiona Marques: It does grab one's attention, doesn't it?

[00:26:53] Kody Henry: If it's a Gemini ascendant also want to look at Mercury. So Mercury is pretty decent there in the 11th, friend signs. So that's a favorable for the naming of Canberra.

 I guess that makes a little bit more logical sense I guess in a sort of philosophical way. That's sometimes how I look at Sidereal placements and then a little bit more practical can be Tropical. But you could find philosophical in the Tropical as well. 

 Saturn seems to be in a neutral sign. So that's also reasonably favorable. In a 12th is not ideal. And I guess I could see that the people losing their land, the Indigenous people, so losing their land. And that's one of the planets I've seen weaken all the other charts is, has been Saturn except for the naming.

But the Sun and the 10th, obviously, it's pretty good. Yeah. What do you see? 

[00:27:44] Fiona Marques: You're just picking up on that Sun in the 10th. I think you're right there that, as a government Capital, we want to see the Sun being strong and of course we do. Yes, we like Sun in the 10th.

I think that having a Mercury ascendant is it makes sense for such an administrative Capital. And Canberra, and most governments, we can take it out on Canberra, but most governments, they have very much this bureaucratic role. There's a lot of paperwork, there's a lot of procedures a lot of administrative management. And so being a Mercury ascendant maybe fits quite well.

Interestingly, when we have a Gemini ascendant, Mercury's going to rule the 1st house and the 4th house. So linking this chart is already linking 1 and 4, just by having a Mercury, Gemini ascendant.

And "4" is our sense of home and sense of place sense of connection. So I like that, Mercury, Gemini, ascendant. However, that 4th Lord of place, the 4th Lord of "my home" is with Rahu. We are expecting that there might be some weirdness about this sense of place, this home. It might be unusual and might not sit authentically or naturally, it's something unexpected. I thought it's interesting that Mercury rules the 1st house in the 4th house and that it's with Rahu.

That does create for us "Deceit Yoga", I'll just do it on screen here for people if we are watching on YouTube. So a deceit yoga is created when the 4th Lord or when there's a maleic in the 4th house and when there are maleic aspects happening to the 4th Lord I, and really it's because, so let me just get that up on screen here for you... yeah. Really it's because that. The 4th house has so much to say about connecting to one's internal truth, because it's our heart center, it's our sense of contentment and that inner nourishment, that inner grounded sense of place. And when we have those maleic aspects, we, that sense of place can be traumatized or under difficult circumstances, and therefore we shy away from it even inside of ourselves. Meaning that we, we are not in touch with our heart as much as we could be. And that can lead us to do actions that are not aligned with our heart, but we might not even realize that. So it's called to deceit yoga because you might end up deceiving people, but really it's that one deceives oneself because one doesn't connect with one's heart as easily.

And I think Canberra can struggle with that. I think it's getting there now. Very hopeful to hear that. But it maybe hasn't been the most heart-centered place in Australia. Yeah. So yes. I thought that was interesting.

[00:30:34] Kody Henry: Absolutely.

[00:30:35] Fiona Marques: Obviously we talked about the 12th house, we've got the Moon being in the 12th house, we can think of the Moon as being one's personality or one's appeal to the masses. And being in the 12th house, I think Canberra does have a bit of a hidden appeal. Where you would imagine it's a Capital city and it should shine and be the first place people want to visit. And it should be just something so luminous and inspiring. As Kody was saying, people go there for school trips and certainly when I was a kid and probably when Kody was a kid, the main thing to go see was the War Memorial, which is a very solemn building and has a very solemn vibe commemorating all the wars that Australia's been involved with, all the lives that have been lost.

So people might get this impression of Canberra that. Yeah, it's a bit of a heavy kind of place or a sad kind of place, or, this detachment because the War Memorial is a little bit like a time capsule. It takes you back to places in time rather than putting you in the present moment.

So I just thought the Moon in the 12th maybe said something about that. The shining personality. Yeah. Being a bit hidden and retreated there in the 12th house.

[00:31:44] Kody Henry: I agree with that and I think with Venus there as well. That's definitely a common thread in Canberra as people disregard a lot of their their emotional needs and their nourishment. With Venus being nourishment and emotions, being Moon and just to work , just to serve the man, just to serve the public service, just to do the administration because it's admin heavy.

So yeah, we're a very, we're a busy little town, a very Mercurial, Saturn based town. And there's not sometimes people can disregard those the nourishment. Yeah. So I can kind of, I can see that in this chart for sure. I can see some of the traits.

[00:32:26] Fiona Marques: Yeah. And then there's, Jupiter is debilitated in Capricorn. It is the 10th Lord in this chart. And that is the 10th house is about fame and status. And it's like you said, the 10th house, the top of the sky. It's the brightest or the place where the eye is drawn to. And here we have the 10th Lord debilitated in the 8th house. And I think that this does give us struggle with fame for Canberra. A kind of the 8th house is hidden just like the 12th house. But the 8th house is I don't know, it's got a murkier, and it's unexpected changes. And it's also all of that hidden occult knowledge and things underneath the surface.

And so Canberra certainly can have its share of scandals or things that happen because the politicians are there and because deals are done behind closed doors. The 8th house can be, a house of sex. So we can have the occasional politician sex scandal, or things that shouldn't be happening.

I think Jupiter, being debilitated in Capricorn in this chart, it's obviously not ideal. For Canberra, that's just the lay of the land on the day that this naming was made.

[00:33:42] Kody Henry: Super interesting. Quite different charts. 

[00:33:45] Canberra Decision Tropical

[00:33:45] Fiona Marques: Now I also had a look at the Canberra decision chart, which is the 14th of December, 1908. Kody, did you have a look at that chart?

[00:33:54] Kody Henry: Yes.

[00:33:55] Fiona Marques: Great. Alright, so I'll speak a little bit about it because I got, I've got the floor here at the moment, and then we'll go have a look at the Sidereal. 

The chart that we have been discussing is the naming of the, of Canberra. So the official moment where they dug up the earth and said this is brick or whatever that's been placed, and we're going to build the city of Canberra. But actually before that happened, they needed to decide where this city was going to be built. Australia's an enormously large country, and maybe you can't even realize how large it is until you leave. But now that I have left, it's a very large country, so you could pick anywhere. And they surveyed lots and lots of different places. But on the 14th of December, 1908, they enacted in law, and I'll just get you the place Yeah. In Melbourne, that's right. Melbourne, Victoria, Australia. The law that enacted the decision that Canberra would be the administrative Capital of this newly Federated Nation. That is the day that piece of legislation was signed. 

And so we have a chart here where I'm looking at it at midnight being that this is the day that it came into effect. And Kody might choose to interpret that timing differently because we don't have a photograph of the governor signing the, or the King's representative signing the piece of paper. So we don't know exactly what time it was. But if we take midnight as the decision for Canberra, the day that it was decided to be the Capital of Australian, I have a Virgo ascendant at 8º40' with Jupiter this time on the ascendant, 14º in Virgo. Nothing in Libra, but then Venus and Mars together in Scorpio. Mercury, Sun, and Ketu in Sagittarius. Then nothing in Capricorn, nothing in Aquarius, nothing in Pisces. Saturn debilitated in Aries at 3º24'. Nothing in Taurus. Rahu in Gemini. Nothing in Cancer. And then the Moon once again in the 12th house in this time in Leo. 

So here we are on the 14th of December, 1908 when Canberra is created in law that it's going to be the administrative Capital.

And I thought that, having a Virgo ascendant , it's wonderful, right? It's another Mercury ascendant. It just feels right that, Virgos detail is what you need in a bureaucratic administrative Capital. So I thought that was very nice. If we look at the "Yavana Jataka" has these beautiful descriptions of each sign and when it talks about Virgo, it says, "A maiden holding a torch. The lands are grassy, suitable for women, sexual intercourse and crafts". And I think that this is, we are really looking for a place that is stable and safe and fertile, this grassy land. It's not rugged and difficult, on the edge of a bluff or a cliff or anything like that. It's a very kind of relaxed, grounded, safe description, grassy, suitable for women's sexual intercourse and crafts. It's it's also a place where we have all of those attractions, like we talked about, the War Memorial, the National Library, and Gallery and Museum. So this is maybe like the maiden holding the torch. The things that show the story of the nation and shine a little light on what it is to be Australian. So Virgo ascendant I thought had something, nice about this the day that Canberra was enacted into law.

And once again, we have Mercury, that rules Virgo, is in the 4th house. So that connection between the ascendant Lord and the 4th house is both in the naming chart and in this decision chart.

So Canberra was always going to be about place. When you look at in Tropical Mercury is got this connection with 1 and 4, regardless of what you look at. Virgo is an earth sign. So it, that's also bringing that sense of place. 

However, Mercury is in a bit of a difficult situation over here in Sagittarius because it's with the Sun and it's with Ketu. So it's actually creating a Shamed Lajjita Avastha in the 4th house, which to me, Kody speaks about this shame thing that unfortunately if you're a Canberran you get lumped with this heaviness around the sense of place and whether it's legitimate and whether it's a real place to live. And we feel a bit embarrassed to mention that we are from Canberra. It's not something you can be proud about. So I thought that the ascendant Lord is shamed here in this chart, sits well for me. And it's being shamed by the Sun, right? It's being shamed by government or by leaders. So we could interpret that as it's being shamed by the king, that really, we don't think of us Canberra as being a monarchy type of place. I agree with Kody on that entirely. But in 1908 when this decision took place, Australia was much more connected with the Commonwealth and with the Kingdom than it is now. And that can bring a sense of shame both ways. So now as Canberrans might feel a sense of shame that they get lumped in with all of these politicians activities and that, that brings disrepute or towards Canberrans.

But also originally I'm sure that royalty would look at Canberra as this area of dirt and earth undeveloped with no remarkable features, no buildings, no plinths and monarch nothing created that looks royal in any way. And there would've been a sense of shame as well with creating your seat of government in a sheep paddock.

So I think there's some very interesting things going on here in the 4th house.

[00:40:11] Kody Henry: The ashamed avastha. You can definitely see that.

[00:40:15] Fiona Marques: Yeah. Yep. And we once again had the same deceit situation that we had in the other chart where we've got maleic influences in the 4th house and then Jupiter the 4th Lord under malefic aspects. So I think Canberra has struggled with finding its heart and finding its truth and being authentic to that inner place of love. And, those are not really words that I associate with Canberra. I think it is growing and changing. So I are leaving room for Kody to correct me here, but when I was growing up, it just wasn't a very heart-centered place. It was about being administrative and efficient and doing the right procedures correctly. So all of those things are important but the softness and the love and that kind of, Truth of the self maybe was really struggling to, to find the truth of the self.

[00:41:06] Kody Henry: And Mars has actually always been really strong, I've noticed in the charts. And we've also got defense here.

[00:41:13] Fiona Marques: Yes.

[00:41:15] Kody Henry: we've also got that Martian element that plays in and we've got the administration and then we've got such, such a strong Martian presence and you've got Mars in his own house. And I think in the other one released in Sidereal Mars was exalted.

That plays into the, just the other things you were saying. Bunch of angry people that were haven't taken a break. And you know that the burnout rate's pretty high in Canberra and and the service that, and work that they put in is huge. So could have something to do with the origins. 

[00:41:49] Fiona Marques: That burnout thing that you're speaking about is so important. You had exalted Mars in the Sidereal on the naming chart. And we've got Mars with Venus here, which really can be that very passionate connection, but that burnout also speaks here to the Sun shaming Mercury, doesn't it?

That, Mercury just cannot get recognition because of that Ketu Sun shaming. That all of that administrative work, it doesn't get recognized. It's something that people feel, again, I'm speaking in the past, but people feel ashamed of being a public servant in some ways. Or if you go to a social event outside of Canberra and you say you're a public servant again, people would think that's some kind of lazy job where you are getting paid a lot of money to, to make things difficult and it's not required. There's something about the job that's not valuable or something. And really, it's so interesting because "public" "service" says it all. It's actually people who are wanting to serve the public and yet, because if we look at it through this filter, the Mercury being shamed by the Sun just cannot get that recognition of their administrative work. Can't feel proud of it. And of course there are actually always administrative things that, do occasionally go wrong, or there is occasionally corruption. Not a lot. Australia's a very well run country, but of course there are the occasional things that do go wrong in public service. And when that happens, it stains all public servants. So Mercury is in a very tricky position there in Sagittarius, in the 4th house. And I think that Ketu in Sagittarius also is showing us that Canberra the creation of this place its expertise was in tradition, it was in culture. It had come from a long line of Westminster system or the Commonwealth and all of that kind of tradition, that it had a lot of strength there. But Rahu is really over there in Gemini asking Canberra to to find its own way and to learn by trial and error to make its own rules. And it's a very interesting moment in time.

The two moments that we've looked at this, 1908 through to that naming 1913 that Australia is stepping boldly into a new future that it hasn't created yet. And it's got a whole lot of tradition baggage, which is a wonderful thing. And at the same time, it that baggage, that cultural baggage isn't related to the land. It's not native to this earth, to this place where we are standing. The clothes that we are wearing are not appropriate. The habits that we have, the lifestyle we have, are not connected to the natural energies of this place. And we're going to have to discover that.

[00:44:42] Kody Henry: Yes.

[00:44:42] Fiona Marques: trial and error, which is Rahu in, in Gemini.

And that's something that I feel has really changed in the 15, 16 years that I've been away, across Australia, but also in Canberra, much more recognition of the Indigenous owners of place. Acknowledging them at the beginning of anything significant. So it's, it is, I do feel in both of these charts that we are talking about that Canberra is growing into itself.

It's something that, that it's really struggled to find its sense of place, to find its heart and its authentic contentment. And also to let go of traditions that were really important and really well developed and worked very well hundreds of years ago in a completely different hemisphere of the planet.

And how do we create the traditions that that are connected to place. And I feel very inspired and proud about what they were really achieving. I think building a Capital, a bush Capital designing a city, like having a competition to design a city, that would be integrated. These were really bold unusual, aspirational actions to take.

But it and so of course as a Canberran, I'm really proud of those things and I have such a love for my city. But it's interesting, isn't it, that those competition winners, we're not native people. It would be so interesting to run this again now! Imagine if what had been done then was consulting with the traditional owners of the land, of how to connect our administration to this earth place that we're, we are in. And maybe we're on our journey towards that now. It's just taken us a little while.

[00:46:32] Kody Henry: I think so. We had Saturn not in very good strength. Back then you debilitated and in the other chart it was reasonably strong. But I think it's been interesting, even with the recent transits of Saturn and it having almost more strength than Jupiter sometimes, or it just being in its own sign or in its favorable position and then all of a sudden everyone's, talking about the traditional owners more and including them, and all of a sudden it's really important.

 Back then, Jupiter was on our side, England, and we thought, "Oh yeah, we'll come in and we'll do our thing, oh, don't worry about the Indigenous, we've already conquered Australia. It's already, it's too late."

Which is a pretty common thing that England has done many places. So it's a, it's the same story. I'd love to do a chart of UK actually. I'd be interested to see where Jupiter is, because I feel like that's the kind of the Caucasian race, aren't they ruled by Jupiter? I think they are.

[00:47:30] Fiona Marques: Interesting. This is where we are so lucky to have absolute times here, and that's that Mercurial thing that we've been talking about because Canberra was created in a very Mercurial way that we have these things. Whereas other places it's more difficult to get those times. 

[00:47:45] Kody Henry: Just about Mercury is, maybe that's why we've only really got two political parties. It's either Labor or Liberal. I don't know if that has something to play, and they're almost, they're quite similar to each other 

[00:47:58] Fiona Marques: more similar, haven't they? Yeah.

[00:48:00] Kody Henry: Yeah. And they've almost become sort of one in a way. I don't know what the future holds, but think you're right about integrating the original ancestors. And Canberra is one of the best places to do that. It's in our name. Like we, we've got a name that comes from original people, and it's such a it's the bush Capital.

And we've got in the south of Canberra, there's there's one of the oldest houses or inhabitant areas for for people in the world. 80,000 years old or something. And it's like amazing. If you go to these places, there's such a, an amazing vibe about it. It's just so old.

It's so old. I was down the road, quite a few years ago, and I'm at the intersection and I'm just thinking, I just had this image like a hundred years ago. There was nothing here. And now there's just, we've just come in and we've planted a road, buildings, shopping centers, everything.

And it's just hundred years ago there was nothing.

And I'm, and that's it's amazing. But yeah, it's, it lacks the depth. 

[00:49:09] Fiona Marques: But I mean it's really, I think the choice of Walter Burley Griffin, but even more the drawings that his partner, his wife, Marion Mahony did of the, that landscape and the integration that I think that was the best in attempt at the time to integrate. Canberra with place with a new vision.

So I, I think they did do the best that they could. I think it was very bold and very aspirational. But has led to a disconnect and is something that's in process and that hopefully, yeah, I think is getting better and better all the time. 

One of the things I did reflect on looking in this chart was when Ketu is with Mercury, it can make a person closed to new ideas and mess with their sense of decisiveness. Not acting on one's guts. You want to over collect data. You want to make sure really sure, like Ketu wants that perfection around Mercurial things. And then I think with Saturn also debilitated in this chart, I think there can be a fear of being spontaneous. Spontaneity is not a word that comes to mind for me with Canberra. And it made me think about Gough Whitlam, which I don't know whether even for Kody's generation that's important to you guys anymore. But that was quite a defining experience for Australia and for Canberra, is that we did have a Prime Minister who in some ways was the most spontaneous, quite charismatic, and perhaps a little more speaking from the heart, or a little bit more integrated emotionally than the general Mercurial politician that we tend to have in Canberra.

And a very large man as well, like a big body. And he was the Prime Minister. But there was this quite dramatic moment where there was a disagreement in the Parliament about how to pass the budget, and it came right down to the wire with the opposition party not being willing to support and the government not being able to pass this budget, which we all know governments need money to work. They have to be empowered by the Parliament to spend the money. And so there was like a Mexican standoff. And the Governor General is the one who pulled the trigger first and dismissed this politician, this Prime Minister who perhaps was the most spontaneous and acting from his gut kind of energy that, that Canberra had attracted.

Do you connect with the dismissal, Kody, or is that something in the ancient past of Canberra for you?

[00:51:40] Kody Henry: No, that makes sense. It makes perfect sense. The Governor General, "we just, we've always had it done it the way we've done it back in where we come from, there's always a tradition that's the way it's going to be". Governor General represents the queen here. Someone comes in like him and says, "Nope, we're going to just do it the way that we do it".

 And yeah, it still exists. I personally love entrepreneurs here in Canberra. They're all in Sydney and Melbourne and Brisbane. But when they come here and they ruffle some feathers, it's great. You gotta have that that Rahu come in and mix things up.

We're a very controlled state. Very, very system oriented and bit stuck with to Sun Mercury. 

[00:52:25] Fiona Marques: And maybe I'll say one final thing and then let's go have a look at it over in Sidereal because we could, this is the thing, you can talk about these charts forever, but it maybe this Mercury, Sun, Ketu combination in Sagittarius in the 4th house, it also speaks to that Canberra the territory that is the , its own administrative independence didn't come until very late in its life.

So if we say that Canberra started in 1913 when this soil was dug, the naming ceremony, it was only in the 1980s that Canberra got its own form of self-government. Until then, it was actually, the whole city, every decision that was made had to be passed by the national government. So it got its own self-government, many years into its existence.

And maybe this also speaks about this kind of Sun shaming Mercury that it just, that Sun, the government, that authority, the king just didn't want to let Mercury go and run its own show. And it's taken a long time for Canberra to even get its own parliament. And now, that has been been going for 30, 40 years, whatever, so it is working and it does have now its own strong self-government. But that was something that it had to fight for. It had to request the federal government to give permission to allow me to make decisions about the people that live here and the resources that they need and the access to services.

So yeah, I think this is quite a significant day, 14th of December, 1908 for me sets some of the vibrations that, that Canberra has experienced. I really enjoyed actually looking at this 14th of December chart. 

[00:54:08] Canberra Decision Sidereal

[00:54:08] Fiona Marques: If listeners can just clear their minds, and let's just recap on the Sidereal, we are looking at this as noon on the 14th of December, 1908. We might not get so into the houses with this chart, but just in case we've got Aquarius as ascendant. No planets in Aquarius. Saturn in Pisces. Then nothing in Aries or Taurus. Rahu in Gemini still isn't that interesting. Okay. Cancer, no planets. Leo, we've got Moon, Jupiter, conjunction. Virgo, no planets. Libra has Venus and Mars together. And then in Scorpio we have the Sun and Mercury. And finally when in Sagittarius we have Ketu and nothing in Capricorn.

And what did you, what spoke to you in this chart, Kody? 

[00:55:01] Kody Henry: I think the Sun and the Moon was prominent because the Sun is, the government Moon is also like royalty, right? And we've got the Moon in the Sun's sign in Leo. And then we've got the Sun in Mar's sign Scorpio. So it's in a friendly sign. We've got Mercury's there with it as well ,friend sign. Quite prominent there. And just found that to be, they've all agreed they're sitting there in, in Melbourne discussing and they go, okay we've agreed, we've come to an agreement. This is where it's going to be. You've got Jupiter there as well.

That's also happy. You've also got Venus in Libra, which is also nice. Its own sign in the, we won't look at the house positions, but Yeah. So we've all come to an agreement, all the ministers. And it just seems to be reasonably prominent. 

The interesting thing is Mars and enemy signs. I don't know, maybe defense weren't too happy about it. Maybe , they didn't necessarily want it to be there. Maybe they wanted it to be close to the water. Perhaps. Maybe that's why they concluded Jervis Bay because they needed an, a wharf point. But maybe they were arguing, why can't we make it, closer to the coast perhaps. 

And the other thing is Saturn is an enemy sign again. So the inhabitants here obviously not going to be too happy because they have to give up rights to their land. They may not lose their land, but they will give up the rights to the land they won't have, and their land will be controlled and transformed.

That was also interesting is that Sun and Mercury being in Scorpio and Scorpio's all about, transformation. So "Yes, okay, we've picked a spot, but we're going to have to transform it". Like it's going to take fair amount of work, fair amount of and with Scorpio kind of being about joint assets, "this is going to be a place where we, we have to work together to, to transform this".

[00:56:53] Fiona Marques: I also see like you, the Moon Jupiter conjunction, feel like that is favorable, as you are saying. I'm drawn to the Rahu, Ketu, Gemini, Sagittarius. I think that's so interesting that's the same from one chart to another.

And I like what you're saying about Venus in Libra, that this is a place of the ministers and here we have all of those advisors, with Mars, which is exactly as it is in the Tropical as well. Venus and Mars are together. Although they're swapping which house they're comfortable in. So in Sidereal, Venus is in its own home in Libra with Mars. In Tropical, Venus is in Scorpio, Mars's house with Mars. But I think what we can say is that Venus and Mars together have that passionate kind of energy. For better or for worse those ministers are energized. The Venus gets energized by Mars. They're impassioned about their advisory roles, but can have some perhaps scandals. And I think that's something that Canberra, not Canberra is dealing with, but the politicians in Canberra are dealing with, aren't they?

That it's time to clean up the energy in Parliament House and it's time for, it's very interesting Venus and Mars being together because I think the energy in Parliament at the moment is trying to find a way for women to have powerful energy in parliament that is not doesn't have to become masculine energy just to be there.

So we have more and more women being elected. That's a wonderful thing. But it can be politics everywhere can be a very bullying relationship where people intimidate each other to try to get them to agree and to vote. And Westminster system has this very kind of adversarial approach to things. And so it suits that Martian forcefulness.

And if you're lucky enough to go sit in question time and you hear the way that politicians speak to each other, it's quite can be aggressive and can be confrontational. So I think that what is going on in Parliament these days is trying to address that Venus Mars balance. How do we be authentically female so that feminine energy is represented in the parliament of Australia.

So maybe the fact that both of these charts have that conjunction tells us how important resolving that issue the masculine and feminine issue is going to be, was always going to be.

[00:59:29] Kody Henry: I think it is getting better. I have noticed that women in Canberra are very masculine, especially the ones that work in the public service. And we've got a lot of powerful women in defense as well. And it's also just a global thing, equality. And I definitely feel the equality in Canberra is it's, I was born in 1994 and it's always been there, there's always been a fairness in equality.

So maybe that. Has developed over the years. I'm not sure. You, what was it like when you were growing up? Was it a, was there a quality in the Venus and Mars?

[01:00:04] Fiona Marques: No I think it, it's been a very masculine place for sure. In order, I worked in the public sector for a long time and in order, it felt like in order to be successful there, you had to masculinize. It just have to wear a suit and speak the facts and yeah create an argument that is based on data and reason. And there was just no point in appealing to the emotions. You certainly didn't want to show emotion in the workplace. That would be just an absolute suicide. Yeah. You definitely didn't want to be vulnerable. I think I don't know. Canberra is a hard place to be vulnerable. Do you think that's fair or

[01:00:41] Kody Henry: Hundred percent. The royal class never show their emotions. They don't, they're a bit Mercurial. They're a bit they show an image, but they don't necessarily show the full package. All the women that I I massage. Yeah, they're very stressed and emotional, but they don't have an outlet to show it. And it could come down to the charts, they're being masculine planets of action, being present with Leo Moon and, the Sun and Scorpio, Mars, very masculine masculine planets and signs. 

 Maybe it's because we haven't got an ocean and people can't, aren't connecting to the water, aren't connecting to the the feminine principles.

[01:01:21] Fiona Marques: And that's interesting, isn't it? Because in that designed city, one of the features is a manmade lake. So perhaps that was the intention to bring a bit more water into the experience. However, it's it's a very contained lake, isn't it? As it's got these concrete walls that are keeping it.

It's there, there is that attempt to bring the feminine in and yeah, perhaps that's an area, for development. 

[01:01:44] Reflections and Summary

[01:01:44] Fiona Marques: And maybe that's the main thing that I'm taking from this opportunity to look at these charts, which I thank Kody so much for reaching out to me and by doing that kind of inspiring an opportunity to look at these charts, is that I think my takeaways are what an aspirational moment in time this was, that the early 19 hundreds in Australia, the Federation what a bold idea that is to bring together these 6 disparate Colonies and try to forge a nation, try to go in a common direction. I think that's really bold. Then in order to do that, you have to find a seat of government and in order not to offend anyone, you have to find a seat of government, in the middle of nowhere, that piece of land is not important to anybody and you can requisition it for this city that you're going to build.

And then, you'd, you run an architectural competition to design the city. So these things are very innovative bold statements of what we want our country to be about. So I loved being able to connect to that heritage. And then what I also really loved about looking at the charts and speaking with you today is that sense of evolution that it's been a difficult birth of Canberra. It's got a lot of baggage and shame around it. It's carries a heaviness. But it does seem to be guided in its evolution. It seems to be following that evolution and learning how to be itself and accept its position in Australia and in the world, and embrace the power of its place, its Indigenous place, the land the traditional owners.

So I enjoyed this conversation for connecting with the bold vision and then having a look at the trajectory where we can look at the last a hundred and something years and see the pitfalls, but also see how those lessons are being learned and is, and Canberra is evolving. So Kody, thank you so much for bringing this topic to The Vedic Astrology Podcast.

Are there any takeaways that you want to share from your research or from our conversation today?

[01:03:59] Kody Henry: Oh come and visit. If anyone wants to come and visit, come have a look and come say hello. No, it's it's a great place to be, it's yeah, the seat of power in Australia people are pretty kind, people are pretty down to earth, we haven't got as much ego, as some other political leaders and that makes us quite democratic and quite a fair nation, so we're pretty yeah, we may have some smokes and mirrors and things like that as every country does with this Mercurial energy, but you could have a, just a chat with a politician on the street and just ask him how he's going and he'll say, "Pretty good mate. How are you going?" And I think that just, that's something as well as, we're actually pretty, pretty relaxed in a lot of ways.

We do a chat, but yeah we've got some issues around Saturn to deal with, the natural inhabitants. It's it's something that we're definitely working on, I think. As we get the knowledge back and we share it, a lot of people will naturally want to connect more. It's just that I think that the schooling system, more of that Jupiter, the Ketu Sun conjunction, things like that, we've controlled the knowledge, we've not necessarily let this Saturnian and ancestral native knowledge to come into the schooling systems.

So the more we allow that, the more Saturn shows its strength shows authority, the more that comes into the schooling system, I think that we will become more, more connected. And maybe that's what we're missing. Maybe that's, maybe that's the true sort of thing that we're looking for. Maybe it's that Saturn because we need the Saturn. We don't, we can't live just with the Sun. We we need the roots. And maybe that's why Canberra feels a bit, a bit fake. We just, we lost it.

[01:05:43] Fiona Marques: Yeah. But we're on the road to finding that truth again. So yeah, it's, I personally have learned a lot about that period in time and what Canberra, what its trajectory is going to be. Really enjoyed speaking with you, Kody. I'm so glad that we got the chance to do this and I'll put all of your details in the contacts so people can reach out to you personally and have a Reading with you or share their interest in their place.

And for everyone who is listening, thank you for your patience with this episode. It's always challenging to describe charts only using words. Thank you for your patience in being here, and if you have a place in the world that you would like to examine, let me know. Let's do some more case studies about place.

Thank you very much, Kody.

[01:06:33] Kody Henry: Thank you very much. That was great. I love this chat. Thank you very much for having me.

[01:06:37] Fiona Marques: You're welcome. Look forward to catching up with you again soon. Okay. Bye everyone. Thanks for being with us today. See you next time on the Vedic Astrology Podcast.